A new one on me.

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soupdragon

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I have six brand new Toyo 4X5 film holders.
I loaded five of them with a new box of Kodak Ektar about three weeks back.
Finally got to go out with the camera yesterday.
Anyhoo, I managed to ruin four sheets of film as, when replacing the dark slide, I discovered the blade had gone under the film as opposed to covering it from ambient.

I can say that the film was not visible after I had loaded it in the holders.

Has anyone ever seen this before?
Is it possible I loaded the film incorrectly?

Perhaps I have bought from a dud batch of holders.

All comments appreciated.
 
I can think of two possible scenarios, both of them very unlikely.

1: As these are completely unfamiliar dark-slides, you accidentally loaded the film into the upper slot, the one intended to hold the sheath, rather than the lower one, but with the film underneath and covered by the sheath. I would assume that the holders were lying flat when you loaded them, so the film would naturally fall to the bottom of the slot. Perhaps the camera was pointing downward during the faulty exposures?
Then when you replaced the sheaths, they ran underneath the film instead of over. I’ve made the loading mistake myself, but it always made re-inserting the sheath very difficult and I was able to correct it in time. Could the new models have looser slots?

2: During the three-week storage, humidity (or lack of it) has caused the film to bow and it has sprung out when the sheath was withdrawn. This does seem very unlikely indeed.
 
It is possible the film was only under one guide, when you loaded it, Then during exposure it slipped out so was the wrong side of the dark-slide. I've hade this happen a couple of times over the years.

Ian
 
I agree with the above, most probably incorrect loading.

What you might also want to do is measure the film dimensions. It's highly unlikely but I have had Harman direct positive paper 4x5, that was too small to fit under the film guides.
 
Thanks all.
I'm guessing incorrectly loaded film it's just that I have never had this issue before.

Still, at least I have a few pieces of scrap film I can use for investigative purposes.
 
One extra thought.
If it's hard to get the dark slide to go into the hinged end flap properly while loading the film: stop and reload the film as that's a very good indicator of the film being in the wrong slot (except for Rollei IR400, which is so thin that the slide goes in anyway).
 
If it is indeed caused by loading in the wrong slot, try this. You will need clean dry hands because you will be touching the surface of the film.
Take an empty holder, pull the sheath back and feel where the two slots terminate. Your fingertip will distinctly feel two ridges, and two grooves, one slightly longer than the other.
Now insert a piece of film, with the lights on so you can see that it’s in the right place. Feel with your fingertip again. There will be only one ridge and one groove.
Now you know what it feels like, you can do a quick fingertip check every time you load film.
 
I have been sat on my sofa for 45 minutes trying to replicate the issue with the known problematic holders.
As of now, I have been unable to deliberately repeat the problem.
My best guess is that I have been infected with terminal stupidity.
 
Last edited:
I replied elsewhere for you but if it can help any newbies here

 
With new film holders, the flap that opens to allow the film to be inserted can be on the stiff side. So, holding the film and the holder, locating the guides, and keeping the flap open simultaneously can be a challenge. But I reckon with greater use, film loading should become easier.
 
I have a very old graflex style film holder with no slots to hold film at the sides, just top and bottom. I always forget to mark it separately when loading and I’ve had film end up everywhere it shouldn’t be with that one.
You have reminded me to have another look at it. Maybe it was intended for glass.
 
soupdragon said:
Has anyone ever seen this before?
Click to expand...

I believe that everybody here has seen something very special in his LF carreer :)

After an exposure I have seen - nothing. Without the filmholder I wasn't able to see the subject on the screen - totally dark even with an open shutter.
It took me some minutes to find the extra thin Rollei IR 400 sheet lurking within the camera. After pulling the slide he obvisiously flipped out of the holder.
Can't say if my loading technique was wrong, or the thin film has been guilty..

Did you follow Martin's hint (measuring the Ektar's size)?
You also could make a Toyo test with two damaged Ektar sheets which should give more resistance than one film (there exist filmholders which don't accept one film and a Stouffer negative together).



AnalogueWendy said:
Maybe it was intended for glass.
Click to expand...

I'm sure - it was.
Alternatively it had filmholding inlays.
If I'm right you could "glue" your film onto an aluminium plate of nearly 1,6 to 1,8mm thickness.
Me too, I'm always glueing my film and paper sheets into my 12x16" filmholders - works fine :)
 
In fact, you’ve now been infected with incurable competence.
It must, as others have said, be something to do with the extreme newness of the darkslides.
 
soupdragon said:
I have six brand new Toyo 4X5 film holders.
I loaded five of them with a new box of Kodak Ektar about three weeks back.
Finally got to go out with the camera yesterday.
Anyhoo, I managed to ruin four sheets of film as, when replacing the dark slide, I discovered the blade had gone under the film as opposed to covering it from ambient.

I can say that the film was not visible after I had loaded it in the holders.

Has anyone ever seen this before?
Is it possible I loaded the film incorrectly?

Perhaps I have bought from a dud batch of holders.

All comments appreciated.
Click to expand...
I too have done this before myself, I now pull the slide back and forth to check the film is properly seated.
 
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